Argyle debts

Posts : 1236 Join date : 2011-06-07 Age : 59

The glue league soon then ? or whatever its called.UTC

Subject: Re: Argyle debts Fri Sep 26, 2014 9:49 pm

If, and its a bloody big IF, If this has the blessings of the FL and if the creditors go for it (and I think they would be mad to - twice as much money in two years time) it's a fantastic move by the club.

I just can't believe the FL will allow it. What a precedent they would be setting?

Posts : 6006 Join date : 2011-12-05 Location : brent out

i hope anyone a day or so late paying their council tax doesn't get a nasty letter demanding payment

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Elias wrote:: i hope anyone a day or so late paying their council tax doesn't get a nasty letter demanding payment

I don't think the council's got anything to worry about, they get full payment and earn 38k, argyle default the council get land valued at 700k

Subject: Re: Argyle debts Fri Sep 26, 2014 9:59 pm

Really puzzling that so many hail this as a great deal,yet when Gardner,Todd and the gang ran Argyle into the ground to the extent that creditors were forced to accept a piddling amount of money as recompense for their incompetence,a heap of hand wringing moral outrage cascaded down from seemingly the same quarters.What exactly is the difference,in moral terms,between this proposal and the CVA negotiated when Argyle went into administration? Certainly there's a difference in scale but none in principle as far as i can see.Maybe someone can put me right on this one.

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Greenskin wrote:: Really puzzling that so many hail this as a great deal,yet when Gardner,Todd and the gang ran Argyle into the ground to the extent that creditors were forced to accept a piddling amount of money as recompense for their incompetence,a heap of hand wringing moral outrage cascaded down from seemingly the same quarters.What exactly is the difference,in moral terms,between this proposal and the CVA negotiated when Argyle went into administration? Certainly there's a difference in scale but none in principle as far as i can see.Maybe someone can put me right on this one.

Well I'm not sure but my take is if the CVA wasn't accepted the we were out of business and the creditors got bugger all, this is different I think because the FC do not have to accept the deal, they can sit tight and get their full wedge over the next 2 years anyway.

Posts : 428 Join date : 2014-09-22 Location : Tavistock

First id like to say i try not to post on you're main page, BUT

This doesnt look good, 35k interest ISNT a massive figure, esp over 5yrs, all harry has done is added 4 more year to paying the debt that should have been sorted with a ballon payment, ive always thought he was cash skint and this sums it up nicely.

Banter aside this is a really bad sign, the sooner you can get rid of Potter the better IMHO

Posts : 1201 Join date : 2011-12-23

The CVA could only be formalised once the FC debt had been settled in full. If Brent is now trying to squirm out of this arrangement it is possible that HMRC, or any one of the Creditors could take legal action.

Posts : 2622 Join date : 2014-02-15

Win/win. Stop the winging the club president thinks it's a great deal for Argyle and the city.

Posts : 428 Join date : 2014-09-22 Location : Tavistock

Damon.Lenszner wrote:: The CVA could only be formalised once the FC debt had been settled in full. If Brent is now trying to squirm out of this arrangement it is possible that HMRC, or any one of the Creditors could take legal action.

Is the correct answer, and looking at the list id say HMRC would be first, and lets face it they would win

Posts : 2614 Join date : 2013-11-21 Age : 63

If it gets past FL/HMRC it's a good move, around £165k a year for the 5 years, club paying £200k at the mo and the balloon is burst....... the risk is, Brent/PAFC defaults, how does PCC turn the empty plot of land into the 7/8OOK (less payments met) of council tax payers money that the people of Plymouth would be owed? and why did PCC cut front line services claiming it was the nasty government made them do it, got plenty to lend Jim it seems.............

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PatDunne wrote:: If it gets past FL/HMRC it's a good move, around £165k a year for the 5 years, club paying £200k at the mo and the balloon is burst....... the risk is, Brent/PAFC defaults, how does PCC turn the empty plot of land into the 7/8OOK (less payments met) of council tax payers money that the people of Plymouth would be owed? and why did PCC cut front line services claiming it was the nasty government made them do it, got plenty to lend Jim it seems.............

No risk to the council I suppose, they get their money back or land to the same value, whereas us lot are just liabilities

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I'm speechless at this really i am.

Posts : 2614 Join date : 2013-11-21 Age : 63

they get a PLOT of land - how does PCC then turn that back into the CASH the council tax payers would have lost........................

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PatDunne wrote:: they get a PLOT of land - how does PCC then turn that back into the CASH the council tax payers would have lost........................

Sell it

Posts : 1321 Join date : 2013-04-06

PatDunne wrote:: they get a PLOT of land - how does PCC they turn that back into the CASH the council tax payers would have lost........................

They sell it to the Odeon.... oh hold on, Plymouth doesn't need three multiplexes.

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so dose brent have any cash?

Posts : 59 Join date : 2014-09-21 Age : 27

Angry wrote:: so dose brent have any cash?

What I could find for his finances;
"The combined cash at bank value for all businesses where James holds a current appointment equals £3,467,922, with a combined assets value of £22,213,709 and liabilities of £43,175,597."

Subject: Re: Argyle debts Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:13 pm

After reading all the comments on both forums it is blatantly apparent that this announcement is as clear as mud. The implications for PAFC, it's creditors, the city council and supporters are certainly not clear at all. Some commentators may know exactly what is going on but there are probably many more giving their versions of what they think is happening. This is only going to create speculation that will only serve to confuse both the fans of PAFC and taxpayers of PCC. Instead of being an informing announcement that leaves nobody with any doubt of what exactly is going on, it is doing the exact opposite.

Whether that is PAFC, PCC or the Heralds fault doesn't matter. It needs clarifying as soon as possible using some plain English that everybody can understand.

I suggest the Trust speaks to both the club and PCC as soon as possible.

Subject: Re: Argyle debts Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:15 pm

Dick Trickle wrote:: Win/win. Stop the winging the club president thinks it's a great deal for Argyle and the city.

From the council's viewpoint it is.

Councils often have stockpiles of cash and make investments. Remember the hooha when Iceland went bust and all those councils had money in Icelandic banks?

So PCC has some money and wants to invest it. Nothing unusual there. After that it becomes a risk management process: the riskier the investment the greater the return if it pays off. In this instance PCC has effectively granted a 5 year mortgage on the land that Brent bought from the club. If he keeps up the payments then they make their money from interest on the loan and if he doesn't they regain ownership of the land. I can't really see anything controversial here. It looks like good business to me.

Quite how it helps Argyle is another matter. It reduces the sum outstanding on the balloon payment but doesn't settle it and I can't see why anybody would half of what is due to them now when they could get double the amount over 2 years. That, very much, looks like bad business for everybody except the club.

And I wonder where it leaves the PAST&DT agreement?

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tagz wrote:

Angry wrote:: so dose brent have any cash?

What I could find for his finances;
"The combined cash at bank value for all businesses where James holds a current appointment equals £3,467,922, with a combined assets value of £22,213,709 and liabilities of £43,175,597."

so he can afford to pay this himself without taking funds from more needy areas in the pcc budget.

is there a watchdog that overlooks council activites i could write too to have this investigated?

Posts : 94 Join date : 2011-11-16

I wonder if the Council would make me a cheap loan to buy that rather snazzy yacht I saw. Surely I must be in a better negotiating position than Brent, at least I pay my business rates?

Posts : 59 Join date : 2014-09-21 Age : 27

Found some more information. Of all the businesses Brent is involved in only 6 companies have a shareholders equity figure of above £0.00. The one for Plymouth Argyle Football Club Limited is -£1,192,750 and Akkeron Hotels Group Limited is -£5,175,992. The best one is Five Directions Limited currently £6,384,103.

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Chancellor wrote:: I wonder if the Council would make me a cheap loan to buy that rather snazzy yacht I saw. Surely I must be in a better negotiating position than Brent, at least I pay my business rates?

they can pay off my student loan if they want piss away other peoples money that badly

Posts : 94 Join date : 2011-11-16

tagz wrote:: Found some more information. Of all the businesses Brent is involved in only 6 companies have a shareholders equity figure of above £0.00. The one for Plymouth Argyle Football Club Limited is -£1,192,750 and Akkeron Hotels Group Limited is -£5,175,992. The best one is Five Directions Limited currently £6,384,103.

Thats pretty misleading as Five Directions only asset is the Pavilions from what I can gather, and that was gifted to them. Its not difficult to acquire a property and immediately revalue it to bolster the balance sheet.

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