GT Questions...

There's been a fair bit of discussion recently here, and on Facebook, about the GT's and their taking over the running of the FPC?

It's been leaked that there is to be a meeting held by the GT's soon to discuss the matter.

After the hissy fit Brent threw at the fans forum when I asked a simple question about how much debt the club was into regarding the GT's, word got back to me that Bent felt bad about it (not bad enough to offer an apology or to actually answer my letter to him himself) but if I submitted my questions to Rick Cowdery he would get back to me with the answers.

Here are my questions and the answers given:


1. The Green Taverners over the last five years have given money to the club and it is understood this debt has to be repaid in either cash or 'kind'.  What is the current amount owed to the GT's and what is the plan to repay them?

They have not 'given money to the club' they lent it to the club between Oct 2011 and Dec 2012  to accelerate (ie bring forward) payments to members of staff. These payments were salaries and other payments which had accrued to members of staff during administration but which the new company agreed to take on and pay over time.

The amount owed to the GTs is £87,550.83, and this has been shown as a creditor on the PAFC balance sheet since 2012.
It will be repaid on a date to be agreed between the Green Taverners and the club.


2. What are the tax consequences of the arrangement?

Repayment of a loan is not a taxable event in the UK.


3. Mr. Brent mentioned something about "administration debts to staff members" ?  The club hasn't been in administration for years - are PAFC still getting money or are the fans attending Fanfests etc, wrong in thinking that the money given to the GT's is still going to Argyle?  For instance, how much was given to the club last season by the GT's?

The Green Taverners have not given any money to the club that needs to be repaid and the only loan is the one referred to above. They have invested in the facility they use for the benefit of supporters and they have provided donations to the club for activities such as the Milk Cup/Super Cup in Northern Ireland each season.


4. Since you made a small fortune off the Liverpool games and have stated the club has made profits the last two years, why hasn't the debt been paid off before starting your other enterprises at HHP?

The club has invested monies received in the manner approved by the Board of Directors in its football teams; in training facilities; its infrastructure; and in improving its financial position.
The Board is proud of the considerable advances that have been achieved and are continuing to be achieved. This has nothing to do with HHP.


5. What are the GT's going to do with the money once it is repaid?

That is a matter for the Green Taverners, not for the club.



What is strange to me is that Argyle seem to be giving up all the revenue that is being made from the fanfests?  Why?  What do the GT's do with that money?  Surely this will not be the arrangement after the development?

Maybe the original story won't wash anymore with all concerned, including government agencies.
Let's not forget one of the main people concerned originally, left and took up with Plymouth Parkway. That says more than any of the above answers.

"The amount owed to the GTs is £87,550.83, and this has been shown as a creditor on the PAFC balance sheet since 2012.
It will be repaid on a date to be agreed between the Green Taverners and the club"

You have to wonder just WHY though its not been repaid in the intervening years. Only in Brents world

Have the GTs paid back the loans given to them in 2011 by the AFT?

Frank Bullitt wrote:

Have the GTs paid back the loans given to them in 2011 by the AFT?

Wasn't there a vote where it was decided it wasn't a loan? I was told at one stage Brent would repay the money through "Community Projects". New and School and Dentists perhaps?

Hugh Watt wrote:

Frank Bullitt wrote:

Have the GTs paid back the loans given to them in 2011 by the AFT?

Wasn't there a vote where it was decided it wasn't a loan? I was told at one stage Brent would repay the money through "Community Projects". New and School and Dentists perhaps?

You maybe right. If that is the case it would be an appropriate gesture for the GTs to incorporate some space into the FPC for the AFT to store their stuff now that they no longer have access to their previous storeroom.

Frank Bullitt wrote:

Hugh Watt wrote:

Frank Bullitt wrote:

Have the GTs paid back the loans given to them in 2011 by the AFT?

Wasn't there a vote where it was decided it wasn't a loan? I was told at one stage Brent would repay the money through "Community Projects". New and School and Dentists perhaps?

You maybe right. If that is the case it would be an appropriate gesture for the GTs to incorporate some space into the FPC for the AFT to store their stuff now that they no longer have access to their previous storeroom.

Good shout that. Perhaps with Ed banger being involved he'll put in a word for them!

Frank, apologies for the linking to the farm, but here's confirmation loan from AFT to Green Taverners was turned into a 'donation' after the ISC voted in favour by a close margin

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Jameson wrote:

You asked the question you have the right to know, after all you could do a freedom of information on the AFT.

In Favour (By memory)

Lee Jameson
Chris Webb
John Petrie
Ed Schilliber
Warren Bowden


Against

Richard Blight
Cellia Ellicot
Margaret Carn
David Tall

It was a no brainer we did not have enough money to buy the club, we did have enough money to help out the GTs who in turn helped the unpaid staff members put food on the table.

It is all out in the open, the AFT was as it is now a democratic organisation.

Lee

Cheers mate.

Hugh Watt wrote:

Frank Bullitt wrote:

Have the GTs paid back the loans given to them in 2011 by the AFT?

Wasn't there a vote where it was decided it wasn't a loan? I was told at one stage Brent would repay the money through "Community Projects". New and School and Dentists perhaps?

There was a commitment from the club to pay the loan back via community projects such as you suggest.

It is also the role of the GTs to use its profit similarly:

"Taverner Mark Russell said: "We are delighted to continue the support they have given to Argyle over the last few months and look forward to a long relationship. The Green Taverners set up to help the community including youth, ladies, disabled team, and local community projects related to the badge of Argyle and remain committed to doing this for years to come. "

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Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Hugh Watt wrote:

Frank Bullitt wrote:

Have the GTs paid back the loans given to them in 2011 by the AFT?

Wasn't there a vote where it was decided it wasn't a loan? I was told at one stage Brent would repay the money through "Community Projects". New and School and Dentists perhaps?

There was a commitment from the club to pay the loan back via community projects such as you suggest.

It is also the role of the GTs to use its profit similarly:

"Taverner Mark Russell said: "We are delighted to continue the support they have given to Argyle over the last few months and look forward to a long relationship. The Green Taverners set up to help the community including youth, ladies, disabled team, and local community projects related to the badge of Argyle and remain committed to doing this for years to come. "

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Was that ever formalised?

Who actually runs the Taverners now, Russell is involved with Parkway and Bill Bob passed away recently.I assume its just Gary.

Depends what you mean by "formalised" I suppose.

The trouble with this old stuff is that it is so hard to find now and many of the Herald links no longer work.

Green Taverners Ltd. Only one shareholder Gary McGuire. His son Liam has joined him as a Director.All on Companies House website.

I hope this meeting on 13th Feb is an 'Open' one.

I think i'd like to get involved with the GT's, would be a worthwhile Argyle cause to get involved with.

So it not a chaity but a Private limited Company?

So why doesn't the football club pay back the £87k loan to the GTs, then there wouldn't be any need to ask for pledges from the fans (who of course actually provided the £87k by supporting GT projects). But then again, nothing is ever that transparent in Brent's world.

Why does the club not run the proposed Far post club, and why does the club not run what i assume is the highly profitable fan fest? will the GT'S be running the Corperate prawn sandwich lark which the Jimmy Jizzers claim will transform the club or will it be another GT LTD operation?

Hugh Watt wrote:

Frank, apologies for the linking to the farm, but here's confirmation loan from AFT to Green Taverners was turned into a 'donation' after the ISC voted in favour by a close margin

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Jameson wrote:

You asked the question you have the right to know, after all you could do a freedom of information on the AFT.

In Favour (By memory)

Lee Jameson
Chris Webb
John Petrie
Ed Schilliber
Warren Bowden


Against

Richard Blight
Cellia Ellicot
Margaret Carn
David Tall

It was a no brainer we did not have enough money to buy the club, we did have enough money to help out the GTs who in turn helped the unpaid staff members put food on the table.

It is all out in the open, the AFT was as it is now a democratic organisation.

Lee

At least two of the people listed as having voted there were not members of the AFT board.

4. Since you made a small fortune off the Liverpool games and have stated the club has made profits the last two years, why hasn't the debt been paid off before starting your other enterprises at HHP?

The club has invested monies received in the manner approved by the Board of Directors in its football teams; in training facilities; its infrastructure; and in improving its financial position.
The Board is proud of the considerable advances that have been achieved and are continuing to be achieved. This has nothing to do with HHP.

I assume it was used to purchase the veterinary to help out with poor old lip quivering Jimmy's pension pot. It's not as if he had the money before.

From the GT's Facebook page:-

Green Taverners
17 January at 09:05 ·
Hi guys,
The Green Taverners Suite will be open at 17:20 on the 13th February - before the Wimbledon game for an open meeting. We’ll be giving you all an update on our new venue as well as some insight into our way forward.
If you have any queries then please come along!

The way forward appears to be that Argyle fans will be paying for their own new supporters bar according to those in the know on Facebook?

Unsurprisingly, the funds for it don't seem to be included in the budget for the rebuild.

Rumours of the GT's needing a quick Million to build it? That's approximately an additional 16% of the refurb cost.