Auditors worried

tigertony wrote:

Rickler wrote:

Graiser wrote:

If all the Brent anti protagonists are correct, we should now be bust, as we are now 18 months on from the date of those accounts.

Maybe we would have been without the 800K loan from the council and whatever Wrathell put in?

When are the latest accounts out?

The next 18 months should be interesting.

Maybe Marks and Sparks would have been bust if they had had less customers.
Do we honestly think that Grizzly would have signed as manager if JB had said to him ''we have no money Grizzly''

Indeed, M&S would be bust if they had (a lot) less customers - so your point is?
My point is...  Yet again, only an unforeseen act of charity from a fan (Wrathell) saved us!

Do you think JB told the many millions of people investing in the banking system not to, when he surely saw the crash coming - and he was smart enough to get out, so he saw it coming...

You say some silly things TT, these were right up with the best of them.

Reading this worries me, and the way it is going strikes me that there is a massive con going on. Argyle stands on, what can only be described as the best bit of real estate in Plymouth and a chairman who desperately wants to redevelop the whole site into something else. I have never believed Brent was interested in the club, just the land it is on.
If Argyle had made it to the next division via the playoffs, it would have made his position as a developer so much more difficult. But to set up a failure in the bottom league wouldn't get noticed... It would be just another club going up against the wall and into administration.
So far, in my eyes, the delays in appointing a new manager has potentially set off a chain reaction which could guarantee the demise of Argyle. The delay means the cream of those available for transfer have already gone.

A solution, perhaps? One of the things Argyle has, outside of the premier league, is a massive fan base. A fan base bigger than any of the Championship teams. Maybe Argyle should look towards a fan based ownership.

Good first post, welcome and hope you post more of your views in the future.This is the only Argyle Fan site that are able to question what is going on at Home Park and without being banned

Good first post....I don't think so.

1.....Best bit of real estate in Plymouth....where does that dream come from,there must be many more better spots and more available than a football stadium in the corner of Central Park.

2.....If he was only interested in the land that PAFC stands on then he is going a strange way of achieving his desire.

3.....A failure in the bottom league as a way of grabbing the land, wouldn't be noticed...you can't surely believe such pie in the sky.....it would be noticed throughout the football community.....PAFC isn't an insignificant little Div2 club.

4.....Delay in appointing a new manager.....what delay.....remember most of that time was down to Sheridan sitting on his hands deciding if he wanted to complete his third year as manager.
Finding a manager any quicker could have led to getting it very wrong....I think it worked out well in a comparative short time.

5.....This "slowness" your word not mine, has started potentially a chain reaction guaranteeing the demise of Argyle......are you really serious with a comment like that ?

6.....This delay of choosing a new manager (unproven)....means that the cream of those available for transfer have already gone.....what cream, I haven't noticed much cream on the market....players contracts finish at the end of June,then we will see what happens with our new manager in place choosing players that he wants to fit in with the squad he has inherited....surely a better way.

7.....A fan base bigger than any of the Championship clubs.....more pie in the sky reasoning than actual fact.....but facts are what you make up,they need to be based on facts.
I live in NW Kent with access to many clubs to choose from.....but I'll mention just one club... Charlton Athletic....their catchment area is SE London and Kent....even if you include the surrounding clubs getting a share of that catchment area....that leaves a few million potential fans.....then there are the potential of the two Sheffield clubs plus Leeds....plenty of population around those places.
Argyles potential is spread over quite a large area with a lot of travelling involved.....it would have to be a very successful period...bigger than the Sturrock years to attract even 15000/20000 crowds to Home Park year after year.....the clubs that I've mentioned above all Championship clubs can attract far more than PAFC could ever dream of getting through a tatty falling down Home Park.

8.....A fan base ownership...it would never work in Plymouth....Fan Base ownership would struggle to raise required money for things like buying players.....and would probably kill the club off quicker than later.

Nikgee, I hope your second post is better than your first.

Nikgee wrote:

Reading this worries me, and the way it is going strikes me that there is a massive con going on. Argyle stands on, what can only be described as the best bit of real estate in Plymouth and a chairman who desperately wants to redevelop the whole site into something else. I have never believed Brent was interested in the club, just the land it is on.
If Argyle had made it to the next division via the playoffs, it would have made his position as a developer so much more difficult. But to set up a failure in the bottom league wouldn't get noticed... It would be just another club going up against the wall and into administration.
So far, in my eyes, the delays in appointing a new manager has potentially set off a chain reaction which could guarantee the demise of Argyle. The delay means the cream of those available for transfer have already gone.

A solution, perhaps? One of the things Argyle has, outside of the premier league, is a massive fan base. A fan base bigger than any of the Championship teams. Maybe Argyle should look towards a fan based ownership.

Good first post.
Welcome to ATD..A small island of sanity in a sea of Aviva.

Nikgee wrote:

Reading this worries me, and the way it is going strikes me that there is a massive con going on. Argyle stands on, what can only be described as the best bit of real estate in Plymouth and a chairman who desperately wants to redevelop the whole site into something else. I have never believed Brent was interested in the club, just the land it is on.
If Argyle had made it to the next division via the playoffs, it would have made his position as a developer so much more difficult. But to set up a failure in the bottom league wouldn't get noticed... It would be just another club going up against the wall and into administration.
So far, in my eyes, the delays in appointing a new manager has potentially set off a chain reaction which could guarantee the demise of Argyle. The delay means the cream of those available for transfer have already gone.

A solution, perhaps? One of the things Argyle has, outside of the premier league, is a massive fan base. A fan base bigger than any of the Championship teams. Maybe Argyle should look towards a fan based ownership.

You were doing quite well up until that little gem FFS !!

AstiSpumante wrote:

Nikgee wrote:

Reading this worries me, and the way it is going strikes me that there is a massive con going on. Argyle stands on, what can only be described as the best bit of real estate in Plymouth and a chairman who desperately wants to redevelop the whole site into something else. I have never believed Brent was interested in the club, just the land it is on.
If Argyle had made it to the next division via the playoffs, it would have made his position as a developer so much more difficult. But to set up a failure in the bottom league wouldn't get noticed... It would be just another club going up against the wall and into administration.
So far, in my eyes, the delays in appointing a new manager has potentially set off a chain reaction which could guarantee the demise of Argyle. The delay means the cream of those available for transfer have already gone.

A solution, perhaps? One of the things Argyle has, outside of the premier league, is a massive fan base. A fan base bigger than any of the Championship teams. Maybe Argyle should look towards a fan based ownership.

You were doing quite well up until that little gem  FFS !!

Yeah, we're massive compared to pissy little minions like Leeds, Wolves, Forest, Derby, Sheff Wed, Brum and a fair few others in the championship aren't we!

Leeds is a city of 800,000 people with one club. How do Argyle have a bigger fanbase than that?

ejh wrote:

Leeds is a city of 800,000 people with one club. How do Argyle have a bigger fanbase than that?

I assume Nikgee was including the whole of West Devon and Cornwall in his statement....it wouldn't make sense otherwise.....I don't agree witht he rest of what he said.....but he is entitled to say it....anyway welcome to the forum Nikgee....I think you will make quite a few friends with your attitude towards PAFC.

Is it not true that Argyle have the biggest catchment area for support, should they want it.

How many already venture up to watch Argyle from Cornwall, is it in the hundreds or thousands.

The same can be asked of those who dwell in other parts of Devon.

In all the years I have followed Argyle, double figure attendances have been rare on the eyes,  only coming in short spells.

When was the last time 20,000 crammed into Home Park for a league game. If Argyle somehow play well next season and are in or round about top seven, the most you could expect is anything up to 9,000+. Which may peak anything up to 15,000 should Argyle somehow manage to make the top three.

Back on topic

Why are the auditors figures not being debated on PASOTI, is it a no-no other there or what. Surely the minions there will need to know about these figures, what they mean and where it could go. Or is the battlefield to be here on ATD

Now we ask what has happened in the past 18 months or so, when are the next audits released, was Brent lying when he said a majority of the debt was spoken for, who is holding the purse strings and so on and so on.

We need some clarity here.

When was the last time 20000 could fit into Home Park if they wanted to?

Will we ever see a 20k crowd again?

Rickler wrote:

tigertony wrote:

Rickler wrote:

Graiser wrote:

If all the Brent anti protagonists are correct, we should now be bust, as we are now 18 months on from the date of those accounts.

Maybe we would have been without the 800K loan from the council and whatever Wrathell put in?

When are the latest accounts out?

The next 18 months should be interesting.

Maybe Marks and Sparks would have been bust if they had had less customers.
Do we honestly think that Grizzly would have signed as manager if JB had said to him ''we have no money Grizzly''

You say some silly things TT, these were right up with the best of them.

Well thats good and an improvement because last year I was saying VERY silly things. Story of my life really
But the point remains - comments are based on accounts from 18 months ago not yesterday. How would you feel being turned down for a loan because the organisation concerned would only use your income from 18 months ago when, since then, its doubled?
Back to being silly now.

zyph wrote:

Good first post....I don't think so.

4.....Delay in appointing a new manager.....what delay.....remember most of that time was down to Sheridan sitting on his hands deciding if he wanted to complete his third year as manager.
Finding a manager any quicker could have led to getting it very wrong....I think it worked out well in a comparative short time.

5.....This "slowness" your word not mine, has started potentially a chain reaction guaranteeing the demise of Argyle......are you really serious with a comment like that ?

6.....This delay of choosing a new manager (unproven)....means that the cream of those available for transfer have already gone.....what cream, I haven't noticed much cream on the market....players contracts finish at the end of June,then we will see what happens with our new manager in place choosing players that he wants to fit in with the squad he has inherited....surely a better way.

Nikgee, I hope your second post is better than your first.

I'm with you zyph - particularly points above. I can't think of one ''cream'' that jogged past.

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

tigertony wrote:

Rickler wrote:

Graiser wrote:

If all the Brent anti protagonists are correct, we should now be bust, as we are now 18 months on from the date of those accounts.

Maybe we would have been without the 800K loan from the council and whatever Wrathell put in?

When are the latest accounts out?

The next 18 months should be interesting.

Maybe Marks and Sparks would have been bust if they had had less customers.
Do we honestly think that Grizzly would have signed as manager if JB had said to him ''we have no money Grizzly''

Do you honestly think Sheridan would have left if he had been told his budget for next season was going to be, say, doubled?

Yes he would have.

zyph wrote:

Good first post....I don't think so.

1.....Best bit of real estate in Plymouth....where does that dream come from,there must be many more better spots and more available than a football stadium in the corner of Central Park.

2.....If he was only interested in the land that PAFC stands on then he is going a strange way of achieving his desire.

3.....A failure in the bottom league as a way of grabbing the land, wouldn't be noticed...you can't surely believe such pie in the sky.....it would be noticed throughout the football community.....PAFC isn't an insignificant little Div2 club.

4.....Delay in appointing a new manager.....what delay.....remember most of that time was down to Sheridan sitting on his hands deciding if he wanted to complete his third year as manager.
Finding a manager any quicker could have led to getting it very wrong....I think it worked out well in a comparative short time.

5.....This "slowness" your word not mine, has started potentially a chain reaction guaranteeing the demise of Argyle......are you really serious with a comment like that ?

6.....This delay of choosing a new manager (unproven)....means that the cream of those available for transfer have already gone.....what cream, I haven't noticed much cream on the market....players contracts finish at the end of June,then we will see what happens with our new manager in place choosing players that he wants to fit in with the squad he has inherited....surely a better way.

7.....A fan base bigger than any of the Championship clubs.....more pie in the sky reasoning than actual fact.....but facts are what you make up,they need to be based on facts.
I live in NW Kent with access to many clubs to choose from.....but I'll mention just one club... Charlton Athletic....their catchment area is SE London and Kent....even if you include the surrounding clubs getting a share of that catchment area....that leaves a few million potential fans.....then there are the potential of the two Sheffield clubs plus Leeds....plenty of population around those places.
Argyles potential is spread over quite a large area with a lot of travelling involved.....it would have to be a very successful period...bigger than the Sturrock years to attract even 15000/20000 crowds to Home Park year after year.....the clubs that I've mentioned above all Championship clubs can attract far more than PAFC could ever dream of getting through a tatty falling down Home Park.

8.....A fan base ownership...it would never work in Plymouth....Fan Base ownership would struggle to raise required money for things like buying players.....and would probably kill the club off quicker than later.

Nikgee, I hope your second post is better than your first.

Blimey Zyph what a post!
You say it so much better than me.
I would've said that Nikgee's post was complete bollocks!

mouldyoldgoat wrote:

zyph wrote:

Good first post....I don't think so.

1.....Best bit of real estate in Plymouth....where does that dream come from,there must be many more better spots and more available than a football stadium in the corner of Central Park.

2.....If he was only interested in the land that PAFC stands on then he is going a strange way of achieving his desire.

3.....A failure in the bottom league as a way of grabbing the land, wouldn't be noticed...you can't surely believe such pie in the sky.....it would be noticed throughout the football community.....PAFC isn't an insignificant little Div2 club.

4.....Delay in appointing a new manager.....what delay.....remember most of that time was down to Sheridan sitting on his hands deciding if he wanted to complete his third year as manager.
Finding a manager any quicker could have led to getting it very wrong....I think it worked out well in a comparative short time.

5.....This "slowness" your word not mine, has started potentially a chain reaction guaranteeing the demise of Argyle......are you really serious with a comment like that ?

6.....This delay of choosing a new manager (unproven)....means that the cream of those available for transfer have already gone.....what cream, I haven't noticed much cream on the market....players contracts finish at the end of June,then we will see what happens with our new manager in place choosing players that he wants to fit in with the squad he has inherited....surely a better way.

7.....A fan base bigger than any of the Championship clubs.....more pie in the sky reasoning than actual fact.....but facts are what you make up,they need to be based on facts.
I live in NW Kent with access to many clubs to choose from.....but I'll mention just one club... Charlton Athletic....their catchment area is SE London and Kent....even if you include the surrounding clubs getting a share of that catchment area....that leaves a few million potential fans.....then there are the potential of the two Sheffield clubs plus Leeds....plenty of population around those places.
Argyles potential is spread over quite a large area with a lot of travelling involved.....it would have to be a very successful period...bigger than the Sturrock years to attract even 15000/20000 crowds to Home Park year after year.....the clubs that I've mentioned above all Championship clubs can attract far more than PAFC could ever dream of getting through a tatty falling down Home Park.

8.....A fan base ownership...it would never work in Plymouth....Fan Base ownership would struggle to raise required money for things like buying players.....and would probably kill the club off quicker than later.

Nikgee, I hope your second post is better than your first.

Blimey Zyph what a post!
You say it so much better than me.
I would've said that Nikgee's post was complete bollocks!

I've written longer elsewhere Mouldy......pepsipete will ban me from the word game with long comments like that, if I'm not careful.

tigertony wrote:

zyph wrote:

Good first post....I don't think so.

4.....Delay in appointing a new manager.....what delay.....remember most of that time was down to Sheridan sitting on his hands deciding if he wanted to complete his third year as manager.
Finding a manager any quicker could have led to getting it very wrong....I think it worked out well in a comparative short time.

5.....This "slowness" your word not mine, has started potentially a chain reaction guaranteeing the demise of Argyle......are you really serious with a comment like that ?

6.....This delay of choosing a new manager (unproven)....means that the cream of those available for transfer have already gone.....what cream, I haven't noticed much cream on the market....players contracts finish at the end of June,then we will see what happens with our new manager in place choosing players that he wants to fit in with the squad he has inherited....surely a better way.

Nikgee, I hope your second post is better than your first.

I'm with you zyph - particularly points above. I can't think of one ''cream'' that jogged past.

Of course there was a delay.  The season finished on April 25th for twenty of the teams in our league. Sheridan must have had a good idea that he was off if we did not achieve promotion. There was no pre season games arranged for this season which should have alerted the board that he wasn't sticking around.
They allowed Sheridan to call the shots.
Add nearly two weeks to decide on the new manager which brings it to over six weeks later.
In the meantime Pompey sign Chesterfield's Gary Roberts, Oxford sign Exeter's Liam Sercombe and Northampton's sign Alfie Potter. All good players.
We, in the meantime, announce there is to be no new signings until the manager has assessed the squad. So make that another month from now. All in all, we are playing catch up.
And by the way, players can sign pre contracts at any time. They then start officially on the first of July.

So getting into the play-offs is seen as a delay is it......Brent obviously gave Sheridan some space after the Wycombe defeat to consider the last year of his contract.....not really a bad thing to do.
Derek Adams then took over and has been assessing the situation....and has missed three good players ?

Gary Roberts left Crewe in 2009, had a reasonable season at Port Vale, then started drifting around smaller clubs doing literally nothing.

Liam Sercombe until now a one club man decided to move on this summer a reasonable player...but who could say that he would fit into Adams plans ?

Alfie Potter has played most of his football at Oxford....but hasn't done much since leaving them awhile back....nothing significant there.

So if that is the cream....we haven't missed much.

With an inspiring stadium eg grandstand and associated facilities with the wow factor, owners with just enough vision and cash to support an ambitious and clever young manager, Argyle could follow the likes of Hull, Reading, Swansea, Cardiff, Brighton in attracting and cementing a fanbase to mirror clubs like Norwich , Ipswich and Southampton who enjoy fanbases of 20k plus even in the 3rd tier................simply because they've had top flight exposure. Even Pompey in their poxy stadium are relatively well supported because of their history in the PL. Reaching the Championship for a few seasons does not have anything like the same effect as Man Utd, Arsenal and Chelsea coming to town and should not be seen as the target of ambition. 
The wider public will simply not buy in unless they see true cash backed ambition.

The fact is that Argyle remains far and away the biggest city club never to have realised its potential. Argyle in the PL, with an appropriate stadium would attract aqverage attendance figures of 30k imo .

zyph wrote:

So getting into the play-offs is seen as a delay is it......Brent obviously gave Sheridan some space after the Wycombe defeat to consider the last year of his contract.....not really a bad thing to do.
Derek Adams then took over and has been assessing the situation....and has missed three good players ?

Gary Roberts left Crewe in 2009, had a reasonable season at Port Vale, then started drifting around smaller clubs doing literally nothing.

Liam Sercombe until now a one club man decided to move on this summer a reasonable player...but who could say that he would fit into Adams plans ?

Alfie Potter has played most of his football at Oxford....but hasn't done much since leaving them awhile back....nothing significant there.

So if that is the cream....we haven't missed much.

This league is more skimmed milk than cream. So the debate doesn't get off the ground does it.

Rollo Tomasi wrote:

zyph wrote:

So getting into the play-offs is seen as a delay is it......Brent obviously gave Sheridan some space after the Wycombe defeat to consider the last year of his contract.....not really a bad thing to do.
Derek Adams then took over and has been assessing the situation....and has missed three good players ?

Gary Roberts left Crewe in 2009, had a reasonable season at Port Vale, then started drifting around smaller clubs doing literally nothing.

Liam Sercombe until now a one club man decided to move on this summer a reasonable player...but who could say that he would fit into Adams plans ?

Alfie Potter has played most of his football at Oxford....but hasn't done much since leaving them awhile back....nothing significant there.

So if that is the cream....we haven't missed much.

This league is more skimmed milk than cream. So the debate doesn't get off the ground does it.

You mentioned us missing the cream not me.......part of your list of PAFC failures.

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

When was the last time 20000 could fit into Home Park if they wanted to?

Will we ever see a 20k crowd again?

When we 'sold out' that game against Forest a few years ago when they gave away free tickets to students?

I seem to remember there being about 6,000 empty seats that afternoon...

Good work, Todd.

zyph wrote:

Rollo Tomasi wrote:

zyph wrote:

So getting into the play-offs is seen as a delay is it......Brent obviously gave Sheridan some space after the Wycombe defeat to consider the last year of his contract.....not really a bad thing to do.
Derek Adams then took over and has been assessing the situation....and has missed three good players ?

Gary Roberts left Crewe in 2009, had a reasonable season at Port Vale, then started drifting around smaller clubs doing literally nothing.

Liam Sercombe until now a one club man decided to move on this summer a reasonable player...but who could say that he would fit into Adams plans ?

Alfie Potter has played most of his football at Oxford....but hasn't done much since leaving them awhile back....nothing significant there.

So if that is the cream....we haven't missed much.

This league is more skimmed milk than cream. So the debate doesn't get off the ground does it.

You mentioned us missing the cream not me.......part of your list of PAFC failures.

Wrong. You'll find that was someone else.

Sorry Rollo,my mistake....it was one post Nikgee.

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