Private Eye next?

Iggy wrote:

seadog wrote:

Compo!

You couldn't feckin make it up could you? Having said that the inhuman treatment of terrorist suspects gives a lot of grist to the mill of the terrorist propaganda machine. Guantanamo Bay facility was put there so the terrorists aren't allowed any of the rights they would if landed in America. Many people have been kept in solitary for years, waterboarded and never actually charged with any offence. Bring them to justice foreshore but lets set an example of how to do it.

Agreed.

This lies at the heart of it all. In a civilised democracy, however flawed, there's procedures that are understood, laws that are, hopefully without fear or favour, enforced and we elect politicians to pass the laws we want to see or abolish the ones we do not like and then there is the right to a trial before our peers before guilt is assigned to us and sanctions enforced as a result.

As a government we sign up to various international edicts like the Geneva Convention, the UN Charter for Human Rights and others besides.

Basically there's rules of one type or another and we stick to them but none of this applies to the terrorist who is free to commit whatever atrocity they wish to indulge in as they see fit with no regard for any sense of justice or fairness.

And, in the end, we will win because the system we enjoy exists through consent rather than jackboot enforcement. In the end every tyrant and dictatorship falls.

This is why the torture and imprisonment without trial that Guantanamo represents is such a profoundly bad thing. All it does is allow finger-pointing, with no little justification, and makes it increasingly difficult for us to portray ourselves as the good guys and if we are not good guys then we must be bad guys and that makes us terrorists too.

a bit like a footballer who having served the sentence given under law is 'prevented' from being a footballer...................

This will really stir the shit in France, if it proper kicks off then the Le Pen factions will be out in force, there have already been threats against Arabs and Muslims and a few shots fired at them to boot. Its the south where the hatred of Arabs is the worst there's a lot of Algerians down there and they're not liked at all by the french. Funny that the French were quite happy to colonise large parts of Africa and loot anything of value but they don't want fook all to do with them now.

They have a blood thirst lust.Just look at Halal slaughter can take up to 4 minutes to bleed to death .1400 years they have used that fine method.Most of us eat that method of slaughted meat daily without even knowing.Should be banned this day and age.

All those involved with Islimism are Muslims. Not all Muslims are part of Islamism.

We need to be careful because as much as anything we're now fighting an ideology. Muslim clerics around the world are not preaching that this sort of action is bad or the actions of IS are wrong and insane. It's not that they don't think it's bad, they just aren't doing it.

If you kill the ideology then you kill the problem as they have nothing to fight for. While I don't believe in religion I respect the people who do so, and believe that the right to choose their religion is the same as mine is for freedom of speech to say what I like about it.

Nobody thinks what happened was a good thing, it was utterly horrifying, but I wouldn't blame this on innocent Muslims. Just so long as they aren't radical and don't try to force their beliefs on me.

Hitch wrote:

Here you go Iggy, your man Rushdie on today's atrocities -

"Religion, a mediaeval form of unreason, when combined with modern weaponry becomes a real threat to our freedoms. This religious totalitarianism has caused a deadly mutation in the heart of Islam and we see the tragic consequences in Paris today. I stand with Charlie Hebdo, as we all must, to defend the art of satire, which has always been a force for liberty and against tyranny, dishonesty and stupidity. ‘Respect for religion’ has become a code phrase meaning ‘fear of religion.’ Religions, like all other ideas, deserve criticism, satire, and, yes, our fearless disrespect."

What goes in and out when the doorbell rings?

Salman Rushdie's arsehole

Josh Pope wrote:

Muslim clerics around the world are not preaching that this sort of action is bad or the actions of IS are wrong and insane. It's not that they don't think it's bad, they just aren't doing it.

A spokesman for the French Council of the Muslim Faith described it as a “barbaric act against humanity, democracy and freedom of the press”.

Hassen Chalghoumi, imam of the mosque in Drancy – scene of those Holocaust deportations during the Nazi occupation – spoke up for many when he said of the killers: “They have sold their souls to hell. This is not freedom. This is not Islam and I hope the French will come out united at the end of this.”

Remember the reaction of the Norwegians post Breivik...Norway’s response was not retribution, revenge, clampdowns; the response ws more democracy, more openness, and more humanity.

Surely that's better than petrol bombing a kebaby, surely it's better than hating 1.57billion people, of whom roughly 1.57billion are entirely innocent...

I agree. But is it enough?

The amount of racism I've seen by people on Twitter regarding this is horrendous.

I must say, watching Sky news, I'm impressed with the amount of resources thrown at the situation by the French.

One does wonder what our response would be? Not on this scale, I'm fear.

Josh Pope wrote:

The amount of racism I've seen by people on Twitter regarding this is horrendous.

I'm not sure if all of that is borne out of ignorance or fear. I suspect a bit of both. If the latter, these militant extremists exploits are working, aren't they?

Looks like the suspects have been cornered into a small factory in a small town, with a hostage. I don't think this is going to end well. Schools nearby as well. Locals must be petrified!

Reckon it will end ina shoot out.

Just said on Sky news, the perpetrators have been in contact and state they wish to die as martyrs. I think that hostage may be in big trouble, FFS.

WTF is happening now? Another shooting/hostage situation unfolds in Paris. You gotta feel for Parisians at this moment in time. What a feckin mess.

Yep kicking off like fook, is there a connection between the two incidents? Man and a woman in the standoff in Paris, mental innit.

Looks like it is connected. Hostage tacker demands the two perps in the stand-off to be released.

Meanwhile the United Nations calls for the French Government to have immediate talks with French Fundamentalist Muslims, calling for two seperate states living side by side as peaceful neighbours and sharing Paris as capital city of both.

Je Suis Juif anyone?

I bet somewher jean marie la pen is going ape shit

Looks like it is all over.

The French plod went in to both places at the same time. Some of the hostages freed. Gunmen all dead.

It's all unfolding right now.

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Looks like it is all over.

The French plod went in to both places at the same time. Some of the hostages freed. Gunmen all dead.

It's all unfolding right now.

thats a huge cock up then if the gunmen are dead thats exactly what they wanted.

I'm glad they got what they wanted. Good riddance.

Les Miserable wrote:

I'm glad they got what they wanted. Good riddance.

what martyrdom? making them live aslong as possible would have been a worse punishment.

Last thing anyone wants is long political trials - more fundamentalists protesting to 'free the Charlie2' etc. They're dead - well played Monsieur Plod.

Martyrdom is a myth, a fantasy, they're dead, caput and I'm well happy with that. What would you prefer for them, a life of luxury at our expense?

Damon.Lenszner wrote:

Last thing anyone wants is long political trials - more fundamentalists protesting to 'free the Charlie2' etc. They're dead - well played Monsieur Plod.

The fact they died doing the lords work in their eyes and supporters it will encourage more not prevent it as the idea of martyrdom whether we believe in it or not is what religious nuts dream off. Not just in the muslim faith all other faiths. Christiantiy had many of these nutters during the roman times and certainly during the 16th century heck we celebrate 5th November still. Long trials would be better than giving them what they want.