The EU referendum rolls on and on.

Be afraid, very afraid, told you so,
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Lord Tisdale wrote:

Les Miserable wrote:

The polls do appear to be wildly wrong(again), most people I've spoken to on the subject want out.

Well there you go, the first poll since Pig Porking Dave gave us the word:- [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

A solid 9 point lead for the Leavers.

Ah yes, the polls that were so reliable in the last election and the Scots referendum.

The Bookies, a far more reliable arbiter are calling it completely the other way. There's no chance the Pig Porker will want his legacy tainted by leaving the EU, like he was never really going to give the Scots independence.

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Perhaps worth a cheeky punt?

Amsterdamage wrote:

Be afraid, very afraid, told you so,
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Who does this twat think he's talking to?

I just hope we can get it over and done with quickly. Last time I voted to stay in but now I'm minded to be contrary, there won't be another chance to make a fundamental change to our country's future in my lifetime.

Re the latest Cameron Jungle comments, I am going to really like this referendum.  
For once in their boring lives, the "flag waving, comfortable, rule following, keep yer nose clean, hard working suburban know nowts" are going to find out for the first time in their miserable safe lives what it feels like to have half a brain and act on it, be Scottish, poor, undeserving, or just plain unlucky. You think you're a loyal subject ? Just wait til they've finished with you.  You're going to be bombarded with establishment propaganda, lies, false statistics and insults to tell you how stupid you are, and that you're just a conspiracy theorist. And there will be little you can do about it. Welcome to the real world.  
Geddon Big Dave, you tell 'em how it is.    

I heard this morning that they've just exhumed Thatcher. Her boy Powell was wheeled out on the radio telling all that Thatcher really wanted OUT, even though publicly she never said any such thing. Time to pin the tail on the donkey. Hilarious.

Charlie Wood wrote:

Last time I voted to stay in but now I'm minded to be contrary...

As I did - but only because Harold Wilson kept the electorate in the dark as to what the broader picture of membership would entail. I, like many, thought it was a group of countries using preferential rates to sell to each other, and I knew nothing of being forced to use metric instead of imperial or watts being replaced by French lumens.

Looking at the decline of our fishing industry: The UK has 80% of the EU's fishing grounds and yet the French are allowed more time at sea. Last August £250m of Bluefin Tuna entered our waters off Cornwall and yet not one fish was landed by a British boat because we don't have a licence to catch them- in our own waters ffs! To add insult to injury, fish quotas imposed on us meant many of our boats went to the breakers while at the same time the UK Government was billed to pay for new trawlers for the Irish Republic.

The next worry will be the amalgamation of the EU's armed forces because almost immediately the call will go for the standardisation of the equipment being used by member states. If that's the case, I think we will see the French and Germans carve out the lions share of the the contracts for themselves while British firms may miss out and eventually go to wall.

Wilson sold our fishing and farming to Europe with the agreement we would use our banks to loan money to their fishermen and farmers to buy boats and tractors, not so great unless you were a banker. They also managed to set the farmers against the fishermen who both blame each other, I have both fishers and farmers in my extended family weddings and funerals are always a great laugh with comments like FFS who put those two next to each other!

When the vote eventually arrives, I will vote to leave the EU. My reasons are more to do with the power that Brussels has and that of Germany really controlling the bloc, with France licking her butt.

Some EU politicians want the UK to leave, one of them is called Martin Shulz and he has made his views well known recently.

Should the UK leave the EU, then it could either be a complete horror story or a blessing in disguise. Only time will tell.

Cameron could go down in history as the PM who was in charge when the UK vacated the EU and also possibly seeing the Union of Great Britain fall apart and break up due to the above.

Martin Schulz airs his views.

VillageGreen wrote:

When the vote eventually arrives, I will vote to leave the EU. My reasons are more to do with the power that Brussels has and that of Germany really controlling the bloc, with France licking her butt.

Some EU politicians want the UK to leave, one of them is called Martin Shulz and he has made his views well known recently.

Should the UK leave the EU, then it could either be a complete horror story or a blessing in disguise. Only time will tell.

Cameron could go down in history as the PM who was in charge when the UK vacated the EU and also possibly seeing the Union of Great Britain fall apart and break up due to the above.

Chill VG, GB is not even a union, the UK is the union and that is safe for a generation, they had their vote and now they see the state of the oil market even the Sweaties aren't stupid enough to pull the Barnett plug.

Schultz is a complete Cnut, nobody listens to a word he has to say.

I can't wait for the little englanders to accept the present EU status quo for at least a generation when the establishment win the day in a referendum. Pigs will fly.

A non EU permanent Tory fief(thief)dom in these islands would drive Scotland out of the UK, with oil, or without it. They'll be putting to sea in thousands of boats if left with just the English to live with.
Commodity price goes up, price goes down. I think people North of the border can work that out as easily as those south of it, probably easier. Scotland siding with the French has an historical irony about it.
The notion that England want's "independence" for itself, while Scotland doesn't, is frankly, naive, and soooooo English.

I think Shulzt has it bang on, Cameron won't get feck all in dilution of our membership rules and was never going to. He's just TRYING to be clever and thinks he can fool the public into believing he has reform, the migrant crisis and to a lesser extent the treatment of the Greeks, Spanish and Portuguese arent helpin. With the Greek Spanish portuguese people are either worried about the size of the bailouts (we want the EU money when they give it out but don't want to contribute to others when it goes wrong) but also there are a sizeable chunk of us, me included, that think that making pensioners starve in Greece is not a solution its just punitive and attacking the wrong people.

[quote="Lord Tisdale"]

VillageGreen wrote:

Schultz is a complete Cnut, nobody listens to a word he has to say.

I sometimes wonder about that. S'funny how last year his fiefdom in Brussels took the UK to court over nitrogen oxides emissions at Aberthaw power station, and yet Germany's Volkswagen Group has faced no such action over it's use of defeat devices to hide high diesel emissions.

Amsterdamage wrote:

there are a sizeable chunk of us, me included, that think that making pensioners starve in Greece is not a solution its just punitive and attacking the wrong people.

And me of course, and signs of things to come elsewhere in the EU. Disgusting behaviour. But then it's not going to be any different under Westminster. A Tory think tank was doing the media rounds a couple of months ago, can't remember their name. Anyway, their main thrust was to lay the first tentative seeds of attacking the pensioners here in the UK. They've just about wrung as much as they can out of the undeserving poor routine, and so it's on to the next target group. The idea was to start the generation war.... it's not fair the pensioners are in clover while hard working young families pay for it da da da da. It was so obvious, it was risible. It might take 5 years, but they WILL try it on, given half a chance. The guarantee pension credit will be the main target as that hurts the poorest first, and doesn't effect their own people at all. Remember, it's all about making work pay. Even when you're 75 and doddering.

Whether Brussels or the westminster palace, OUR representatives do the bidding of the corporations and capitalist markets, full stop. Even in fishing and farming, they hugely favour the big operators and want rid of the small businessmen. Not a cigarette paper between either of these long corrupted parliaments.

Lord Biro wrote:

Amsterdamage wrote:

there are a sizeable chunk of us, me included, that think that making pensioners starve in Greece is not a solution its just punitive and attacking the wrong people.

And me of course, and signs of things to come elsewhere in the EU. Disgusting behaviour. But then it's not going to be any different under Westminster. A Tory think tank was doing the media rounds a couple of months ago, can't remember their name. Anyway, their main thrust was to lay the first tentative seeds of attacking the pensioners here in the UK. They've just about wrung as much as they can out of the undeserving poor routine, and so it's on to the next target group. The idea was to start the generation war.... it's not fair the pensioners are in clover while hard working young families pay for it da da da da. It was so obvious, it was risible. It might take 5 years, but they WILL try it on, given half a chance. The guarantee pension credit will be the main target as that hurts the poorest first, and doesn't effect their own people at all. Remember, it's all about making work pay. Even when you're 75 and doddering.

Whether Brussels or the westminster palace, OUR representatives do the bidding of the corporations and capitalist markets, full stop. Even in fishing and farming, they hugely favour the big operators and want rid of the small businessmen. Not a cigarette paper between either of these long corrupted parliaments.

Can't argue with much of that, as a fifty two year old I can see my pension start date just inching away from me like in one of those dreams where you have to run but your legs won't move, scary. The only thing about the Tories doing stuff is we have a little more chance of booting them out and with more and more people living longer the grey vote gets more powerful. Up until now they have been very careful about upsetting the wrinklies but on the other hand the senile old twats are the biggest supporters of the Tories so maybe they deserve it.

Amsterdamage wrote:

Up until now they have been very careful about upsetting the wrinklies but on the other hand the senile old twats are the biggest supporters of the Tories so maybe they deserve it.

You do make I larf.

Do you seriously think think things would be any better for the average Joe if Brain Dead Ed were PM today?

I guarantee you one thing, there would be no referendum on an EU exit.

The wrinkly vote will always be of the utmost importance, the generation retiring now have more to lose than any generation before them or most probably of any to come. We are the new land owning aristocracy, politicians floating the idea of taking from the rich to give to the poor have less chance of getting a madge now than ever before. Blair and Mandy's tactic of limitless immigration will not pay off for a long time yet, when we have millions of pith poor immigrants retiring is when you will see someone proposing a big giveaway elected, until then us wrinklies will carry on voting for what is good for us.

Hugh Midde wrote:

Lord Tisdale wrote:

VillageGreen wrote:

Schultz is a complete Cnut, nobody listens to a word he has to say.

I sometimes wonder about that. S'funny how last year his fiefdom in Brussels took the UK to court over nitrogen oxides emissions at Aberthaw power station, and yet Germany's Volkswagen Group has faced no such action over it's use of defeat devices to hide high diesel emissions.

That's just part of the general EUSSR fcuk over of the UK, it wouldn't matter if Schultz or Mickey Mouse were in the seat, we are for screwing.

True, no matter the colour of the government, you are never any better off. May as well vote looney or Liberal

Lord Tisdale wrote:

Amsterdamage wrote:

Up until now they have been very careful about upsetting the wrinklies but on the other hand the senile old twats are the biggest supporters of the Tories so maybe they deserve it.

You do make I larf.

Do you seriously think think things would be any better for the average Joe if Brain Dead Ed were PM today?

I guarantee you one thing, there would be no referendum on an EU exit.

The wrinkly vote will always be of the utmost importance, the generation retiring now have more to lose than any generation before them or most probably of any to come. We are the new land owning aristocracy, politicians floating the idea of taking from the rich to give to the poor have less chance of getting a madge now than ever before. Blair and Mandy's tactic of limitless immigration will not pay off for a long time yet, when we have millions of pith poor immigrants retiring is when you will see someone proposing a big giveaway elected, until then us wrinklies will carry on voting for what is good for us.

Look Tis old fella do me a favour and listen real hard, I'm not all for modern day capitalism but that doesn't make me a communist, I didn't vote Tory, Labour or Liberal. I happened to think that Millipede was a bigger cnut than Divvy Dave (at least you know where you stand with a real Tory). I'm one of the protest voters who chop and change with the wind. I think party politics is divisive and should be scrapped, (and yeh yeh I do know it could always be worse and have never wanted to live in Siberia but I digress). I am presently leaning to the left because with two Tory parties fighting for power we have swung so far to the right that it needs adjusting. I am also disillusioned with the selfish politics and voting of today, I've made most of my money, not wealthy but I've lived hand to mouth and not only do I not want to do it again I don't feel comfortable with twenty percent of the population having to whether Divvy feels they deserve it or not. We are a growing number, no matter how much we are derided, put in the wrong box and written off change is a coming and I can't wait.

pepsipete wrote:

True, no matter the colour of the government, you are never any better off.  May as well vote looney or Liberal

You may as well Pete, because Westminster is just a puppet government subservient to the Eu's every whim, no matter how damaging to the UK.

Best get out before everything we as a nation hold dear is destroyed.

As if to prove my above point to Tis, taken from story about Trumpy and Sanders in the New Hampshire primary race, it would seem its not only me,

"Senator Bernie Sanders, who beat Democratic rival Hillary Clinton by a huge margin, said his victory showed people wanted "real change".

Both candidates are riding on a wave of discontent with mainstream politics.

"What the people here have said is that given the enormous crises facing our country, it is just too late for the same old, same old establishment politics and establishment economics," Mr Sanders said in speech to his supporters late on Tuesday.

The 74-year-old has vowed to eradicate income inequality, provide free university education and break up big banks."

Isn't it comforting to know that we've got David Cameron..... .

Amsterdamage wrote:

As if to prove my above point to Tis, taken from story about Trumpy and Sanders in the New Hampshire primary race, it would seem its not only me,

"Senator Bernie Sanders, who beat Democratic rival Hillary Clinton by a huge margin, said his victory showed people wanted "real change".

Both candidates are riding on a wave of discontent with mainstream politics.

"What the people here have said is that given the enormous crises facing our country, it is just too late for the same old, same old establishment politics and establishment economics," Mr Sanders said in speech to his supporters late on Tuesday.

The 74-year-old has vowed to eradicate income inequality, provide free university education and break up big banks."

Yer problem Hammy is that, were a by then 75 year old Sanders to win the General, which he wont, the POTUS really doesn't have much power when it comes to US domestic politics. Sanders could sit in the White House and pontificate all he wanted but Congress and the interest groups could stymie anything he might want to do.

No candidate can win the US on a platform of massive tax rises, I would be very surprised if he can maintain his lead over the abject witch Hills once the Dems work out that they are committing financial suicide if they run him, the same people fund the Democrats as the Republicans, funding a scrappy insurgency run for the nomination through internet crowd funding is not the same as running for the top job, that, as the septics might say, is a whole other ball game.

Yet again Tis you miss the point by a mile, the times they are a changin, not going to be changed by Milli, Corby, Nigey or some goddam American but people are looking for something a bit different hence the Corby landslide and these little blips against the mainstream safe bets. Sure he won't win an election because the establishment won't let him but the establishment is sounding very tired and more than a bit worried.
Anyway who really gives a feck who wins the primaries or the Whitehouse? Out of our control but one thing is for sure if the system doesn't change then the system will be replaced, how long do you give the present civilisation lasting at its present trajectory? Sure well be alright but I'm starting to worry about the grand kids already. The sad thing is where America lead we follow I would rather the UK follow a doddery old 79 year old with a social conciense than a billionaire warmongerer like trump but then I've always been a bit of a hippy.

Amsterdamage wrote:

Yet again Tis you miss the point by a mile, the times they are a changin, not going to be changed by Milli, Corby, Nigey or some goddam American but people are looking for something a bit different hence the Corby landslide and these little blips against the mainstream safe bets. Sure he won't win an election because the establishment won't let him but the establishment is sounding very tired and more than a bit worried.
Anyway who really gives a feck who wins the primaries or the Whitehouse? Out of our control but one thing is for sure if the system doesn't change then the system will be replaced, how long do you give the present civilisation lasting at its present trajectory? Sure well be alright but I'm starting to worry about the grand kids already. The sad thing is where America lead we follow I would rather the UK follow a doddery old 79 year old with a social conciense than a billionaire warmongerer like trump but then I've always been a bit of a hippy.

The "establishment" don't decide elections, the voters do, nobody with a brain is going to vote for doddery old fools like Jihadi Jez or Comrade Bernie.

Not sure where the idea of Trumpy being a warmonger comes from, perhaps if you checked you are taking the correct meds.