In the "News" today.

You are a pathetic ignorant idiot if you truly believe that criticising all religion is racist. It's buffoons like you that seek to stifle and silence legitimate debate that should be dismissed. You lack a basic and fundamental understanding of what racism is - please read some books by clever people before you start libelling people who uphold views of truth and reason on a public forum. I am, by the way, anti-theist and unashamed of it.

Go on muddy that water mate, wonder what your views are on this, do they deserves it?
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This is the result of ignorance.

Hitch wrote:

You are a pathetic ignorant idiot if you truly believe that criticising all religion is racist. It's buffoons like you that seek to stifle and silence legitimate debate that should be dismissed. You lack a basic and fundamental understanding of what racism is - please read some books by clever people before you start libelling people who uphold views of truth and reason on a public forum. I am, by the way, anti-theist and unashamed of it.

But you aren't just criticising all religions you are failing to differentiate between extreme Islam and Islam the faith as recognised by the majority of Muslims thereby portraying ALL Muslims as murderers or at least complicit in murder.

Iggy wrote:

Hitch wrote:

You are a pathetic ignorant idiot if you truly believe that criticising all religion is racist. It's buffoons like you that seek to stifle and silence legitimate debate that should be dismissed. You lack a basic and fundamental understanding of what racism is - please read some books by clever people before you start libelling people who uphold views of truth and reason on a public forum. I am, by the way, anti-theist and unashamed of it.

But you aren't just criticising all religions you are failing to differentiate between extreme Islam and Islam the faith as recognised by the majority of Muslims thereby portraying ALL Muslims as murderers or at least complicit in murder.

Where have I said that? I didn't. Read what I have said about ALL religion poisoning everything. You are being deliberately provocative with no basis in fact or truth and I should appreciate you stopping it please.

Hitch wrote:

Iggy wrote:

Hitch wrote:

You are a pathetic ignorant idiot if you truly believe that criticising all religion is racist. It's buffoons like you that seek to stifle and silence legitimate debate that should be dismissed. You lack a basic and fundamental understanding of what racism is - please read some books by clever people before you start libelling people who uphold views of truth and reason on a public forum. I am, by the way, anti-theist and unashamed of it.

But you aren't just criticising all religions you are failing to differentiate between extreme Islam and Islam the faith as recognised by the majority of Muslims thereby portraying ALL Muslims as murderers or at least complicit in murder.

Where have I said that? I didn't. Read what I have said about ALL religion poisoning everything. You are being deliberately provocative with no basis in fact or truth and I should appreciate you stopping it please.

I'm calling bullshit again, you made the statement that because Islam declares death to apostates then all 1.6bn Muslims in the world are complicit and/or at least supportive of IS ideals and actions. Hide it in as much anti religion diatribe (that most of I would agree with by the way) but the fact remains you are not making the distinction between militant Islam and the majority of Islam. That is what offends me and makes you guilty of inciting racial hatred.

Iggy wrote:

Hitch wrote:

Iggy wrote:

Hitch wrote:

You are a pathetic ignorant idiot if you truly believe that criticising all religion is racist. It's buffoons like you that seek to stifle and silence legitimate debate that should be dismissed. You lack a basic and fundamental understanding of what racism is - please read some books by clever people before you start libelling people who uphold views of truth and reason on a public forum. I am, by the way, anti-theist and unashamed of it.

But you aren't just criticising all religions you are failing to differentiate between extreme Islam and Islam the faith as recognised by the majority of Muslims thereby portraying ALL Muslims as murderers or at least complicit in murder.

Where have I said that? I didn't. Read what I have said about ALL religion poisoning everything. You are being deliberately provocative with no basis in fact or truth and I should appreciate you stopping it please.

I'm calling bullshit again, you made the statement that because Islam declares death to apostates then all 1.6bn Muslims in the world are complicit and/or at least supportive of IS ideals and actions. Hide it in as much anti religion diatribe (that most of I would agree with by the way) but the fact remains you are not making the distinction between militant Islam and the majority of Islam. That is what offends me and makes you guilty of inciting racial hatred.

You are a dangerous imbecilic liar. I said Islam teaches impressionable children and the vulnerable that apostasy is punishable by death. That is an undeniable fact. It is this intimidation and other disgusting false teachings, the religion, that I have issues with. The timid brain-washed are victims of the abuse. I want rid of the abusers.

[quote="Hitch"]

GreenSam wrote:

Hitch wrote:

GreenSam wrote:

Hitch wrote:

GreenSam wrote:

Well whether they should subsidies and tax-breaks is another debate altogether, but those who DO want to practise their religion peacefully (which, even you must surely admit is the overwhelming majority) should be able to do so even if you don't agree with the principle of it.

Again, you say that Islam's followers refuse point blank to reform. If we are to take it that most Muslims despise ISIS and jihadists (and why the heck wouldn't they because Muslims are the number one victims of jihadists) then why exactly does their religion need reforming if the vast majority of people practise it in a peaceful way anyway.

The people who need reforming or preferably being locked up forever are the jihadists. And whilst I know that you surely can't really think that jihadists are representative of the majority of Muslims, I still would strongly disagree with your text I tackled in the previous paragraphs which suggests otherwise.

Do you know what the penalty for apostasy is as taught by 'moderate' Imams in THIS country ? Death. Forced religious teaching and indoctrination of the very young and impressionable is nothing short of child abuse. Talk to a few women born into muslim families about how they feel they are treated. Infact if you can find any talk especially to women born in Saudi Arabia. Wahhabism is particularly evil.

All religious teaching is the practice of telling lies to the very young, the vulnerable and the stupid. I'd personally like it all consigned to museums and history or preferably wiped from the face of the earth. Maybe it'll happen in the next few thousand years after the apocalypse.

Making sweeping statements such as 'moderate Imams support death for apostasy' is part of the problem in my opinion. Do they all? Do anything like all Muslims support it? Again the answers to both is no.

What you are doing in my view (which I STRONGLY disagree with) is writing off all Muslims who want to follow a peaceful interpretation of their faith just because a small minority support barbarous punishments and a much smaller minority perform barbarous actions. The many peaceful Muslims who I know and in one case have lived with would be shocked at the very idea that someone would generalise him as supporting such monstrous actions.

You talk about 'if I can talk to' somebody, but I'd spin that on its head and say if you actually talk to the many Muslims in this country who are good, kind and more liberal than you or even me then you may change your views too.

Have a listen to this.

Apostasy = Death penalty

All of the 1.6 billions Muslims in the world must have spoken with their lips closed in that video.

Impressive feat that it didn't create more of an echo.

It's what ALL the 1.6 billion Muslims in the world were taught as impressionable and vulnerable kids. You do accept that right?[/quote]

I refer you to your own words, now isn't that what you are denying you said?
Aposty=death
It's what all 1.6 billion Muslims in the world......

Sorry if I missed the bit where you mentioned that not all Muslims would think of killing anyone at all as murder is a sin to the devout Muslim. (Not IS as fanatics of Islam obviously.) If you don't make that distinction then you are IMO inciting racial hatred and a racist, if you are happy to make the distinction then I would obviously have to withdraw my accusation and move on. So far it stands.

I don't mind anybody being a bit racist towards me, it's trying to blow me up and kill me that really annoys me.

PatDunne wrote:

I don't mind anybody being a bit racist towards me, it's trying to blow me up and kill me that really annoys me.

I hate racists whether they aim their bile at me or elsewhere, would have to agree on being blown up and killed though.

Iggy wrote:

Hitch wrote:

GreenSam wrote:

Hitch wrote:

GreenSam wrote:

Hitch wrote:

GreenSam wrote:

Well whether they should subsidies and tax-breaks is another debate altogether, but those who DO want to practise their religion peacefully (which, even you must surely admit is the overwhelming majority) should be able to do so even if you don't agree with the principle of it.

Again, you say that Islam's followers refuse point blank to reform. If we are to take it that most Muslims despise ISIS and jihadists (and why the heck wouldn't they because Muslims are the number one victims of jihadists) then why exactly does their religion need reforming if the vast majority of people practise it in a peaceful way anyway.

The people who need reforming or preferably being locked up forever are the jihadists. And whilst I know that you surely can't really think that jihadists are representative of the majority of Muslims, I still would strongly disagree with your text I tackled in the previous paragraphs which suggests otherwise.

Do you know what the penalty for apostasy is as taught by 'moderate' Imams in THIS country ? Death. Forced religious teaching and indoctrination of the very young and impressionable is nothing short of child abuse. Talk to a few women born into muslim families about how they feel they are treated. Infact if you can find any talk especially to women born in Saudi Arabia. Wahhabism is particularly evil.

All religious teaching is the practice of telling lies to the very young, the vulnerable and the stupid. I'd personally like it all consigned to museums and history or preferably wiped from the face of the earth. Maybe it'll happen in the next few thousand years after the apocalypse.

Making sweeping statements such as 'moderate Imams support death for apostasy' is part of the problem in my opinion. Do they all? Do anything like all Muslims support it? Again the answers to both is no.

What you are doing in my view (which I STRONGLY disagree with) is writing off all Muslims who want to follow a peaceful interpretation of their faith just because a small minority support barbarous punishments and a much smaller minority perform barbarous actions. The many peaceful Muslims who I know and in one case have lived with would be shocked at the very idea that someone would generalise him as supporting such monstrous actions.

You talk about 'if I can talk to' somebody, but I'd spin that on its head and say if you actually talk to the many Muslims in this country who are good, kind and more liberal than you or even me then you may change your views too.

Have a listen to this.

Apostasy = Death penalty

All of the 1.6 billions Muslims in the world must have spoken with their lips closed in that video.

Impressive feat that it didn't create more of an echo.

It's what ALL the 1.6 billion Muslims in the world were taught as impressionable and vulnerable kids. You do accept that right?[/quote]

I refer you to your own words, now isn't that what you are denying you said?
Aposty=death
It's what all 1.6 billion Muslims in the world......

Sorry if I missed the bit where you mentioned that not all Muslims would think of killing anyone at all as murder is a sin to the devout Muslim. (Not IS as fanatics of Islam obviously.) If you don't make that distinction then you are IMO inciting racial hatred and a racist, if you are happy to make the distinction then I would obviously have to withdraw my accusation and move on. So far it stands.

It's what they were and are ALL TAUGHT amongst other terrible shite at a young and vulnerable age - do you deny this? Are you an apostasy denier? Just as well not all of them follow the TEACHING. Are you so dim that you can't differentiate between the loathing of teaching of religious nonsense and racism? Idiotic, obnoxious fool.

PatDunne wrote:

I don't mind anybody being a bit racist towards me, it's trying to blow me up and kill me that really annoys me.

I hate anybody who calls someone a racist because they're so pig-ignorant to know what racism means. They are sinister, nasty and dangerous.

Just to clarify, I find a suicide bomber rather more offensive than for example a person drawing a cartoon of a monkey.

Hitch wrote:

Iggy wrote:

Hitch wrote:

GreenSam wrote:

Hitch wrote:

GreenSam wrote:

Hitch wrote:

GreenSam wrote:

Well whether they should subsidies and tax-breaks is another debate altogether, but those who DO want to practise their religion peacefully (which, even you must surely admit is the overwhelming majority) should be able to do so even if you don't agree with the principle of it.

Again, you say that Islam's followers refuse point blank to reform. If we are to take it that most Muslims despise ISIS and jihadists (and why the heck wouldn't they because Muslims are the number one victims of jihadists) then why exactly does their religion need reforming if the vast majority of people practise it in a peaceful way anyway.

The people who need reforming or preferably being locked up forever are the jihadists. And whilst I know that you surely can't really think that jihadists are representative of the majority of Muslims, I still would strongly disagree with your text I tackled in the previous paragraphs which suggests otherwise.

Do you know what the penalty for apostasy is as taught by 'moderate' Imams in THIS country ? Death. Forced religious teaching and indoctrination of the very young and impressionable is nothing short of child abuse. Talk to a few women born into muslim families about how they feel they are treated. Infact if you can find any talk especially to women born in Saudi Arabia. Wahhabism is particularly evil.

All religious teaching is the practice of telling lies to the very young, the vulnerable and the stupid. I'd personally like it all consigned to museums and history or preferably wiped from the face of the earth. Maybe it'll happen in the next few thousand years after the apocalypse.

Making sweeping statements such as 'moderate Imams support death for apostasy' is part of the problem in my opinion. Do they all? Do anything like all Muslims support it? Again the answers to both is no.

What you are doing in my view (which I STRONGLY disagree with) is writing off all Muslims who want to follow a peaceful interpretation of their faith just because a small minority support barbarous punishments and a much smaller minority perform barbarous actions. The many peaceful Muslims who I know and in one case have lived with would be shocked at the very idea that someone would generalise him as supporting such monstrous actions.

You talk about 'if I can talk to' somebody, but I'd spin that on its head and say if you actually talk to the many Muslims in this country who are good, kind and more liberal than you or even me then you may change your views too.

Have a listen to this.

Apostasy = Death penalty

All of the 1.6 billions Muslims in the world must have spoken with their lips closed in that video.

Impressive feat that it didn't create more of an echo.

It's what ALL the 1.6 billion Muslims in the world were taught as impressionable and vulnerable kids. You do accept that right?[/quote]

I refer you to your own words, now isn't that what you are denying you said?
Aposty=death
It's what all 1.6 billion Muslims in the world......

Sorry if I missed the bit where you mentioned that not all Muslims would think of killing anyone at all as murder is a sin to the devout Muslim. (Not IS as fanatics of Islam obviously.) If you don't make that distinction then you are IMO inciting racial hatred and a racist, if you are happy to make the distinction then I would obviously have to withdraw my accusation and move on. So far it stands.

It's what they were and are ALL TAUGHT amongst other terrible shite at a young and vulnerable age - do you deny this? Are you an apostasy denier? Just as well not all of them follow the TEACHING. Are you so dim that you can't differentiate between the loathing of teaching of religious nonsense and racism? Idiotic, obnoxious fool.

Oh come, come, you heap unworthy praise upon myself with your platitudes, I am not worthy. I am no Apostate denier I am saying that you fail to make the distinction between radical and moderate Muslims, you constantly avoid doing so, if you would make the distinction then I will accept it and move on, whilst you wriggle and squirm and avoid my direct and simple question I call you racist because you are implying that 1.6bn people of this world, all of the same religion think that killing is mandatory for apostasy which is plain wrong.

School and going to church must have been a truly rubbish experience for you if you believe that people being taught something is the same as thinking it's true for the rest of their lives. I have answered your question several times, of course there is a distinction. I can't legislate for you being too simple to understand it and to constantly ignore highly intelligible language.

I shall call you Iggliar the Apostasy Denier from hence forth.

You know the holocaust really happened don't you?

Bravo Hitch, well done, you've finally made the distinction and I can withdraw the remark, please point out exactly where you did it before as I missed it. I shall ignore your other unsubstantiated remarks about myself, you can draw no conclusions about me because I haven't elaborated on my feelings I have just repeatedly asked the same question which up until now you have avoided to answer.
Peace.

Iggy wrote:

Bravo Hitch, well done, you've finally made the distinction and I can withdraw the remark, please point out exactly where you did it before as I missed it. I shall ignore your other unsubstantiated remarks about myself, you can draw no conclusions about me because I haven't elaborated on my feelings I have just repeatedly asked the same question which up until now you have avoided to answer.
Peace.

Hitch wrote:

School and going to church must have been a truly rubbish experience for you if you believe that people being taught something is the same as thinking it's true for the rest of their lives. I have answered your question several times, of course there is a distinction. I can't legislate for you being too simple to understand it and to constantly ignore highly intelligible language.

I shall call you Iggliar the Apostasy Denier from hence forth.

You know the holocaust really happened don't you?

Iggy wrote:

I shall ignore your other unsubstantiated remarks about myself, you can draw no conclusions about me because I haven't elaborated on my feelings

The death penalty for apostasy taught in mosques and the Holocaust - they are both very real and very much substantiated. You simply can't deny it.

You made a simple statement, I asked a simple question, the wider debate on religion is immaterial to the question posed, keep it on track old boy you'll confuse yourself and slip up again.
Take my advice and go and travel in some Muslim countries, then come back and debate with one that has.

I was advised at an early age to not bother debating with idiots, liars, apostasy deniers and clowns who play a racist card when they clearly have no education as to what racism actually means. About time I heeded the advice. Out.

Hitch wrote:

I was advised at an early age to not bother debating with idiots, liars, apostasy deniers and clowns who play a racist card when they clearly have no education as to what racism actually means. About time I heeded the advice. Out.  

Wise words, whoever it was obviously knows you well, an idiot would run rings round you as you huff and puff and dodge and weave about the "debate."

Think some people are confusing race with religion. For instance you do not have to be a Jew to be Israili.

pepsipete wrote:

Think some people are confusing race with religion.  For instance you do not have to be a Jew to be Israili.

Just a few ignorant idiots Pete who are incapable of reading a cogent argument against organised religion before leaping on the racist bandwagon in a pathetic attempt to stifle truth and reason. So weak, so ignorant, so stupid, so village, so sinister, so dangerous but somehow so predictable.

The only thing that anybody can succeed at when debating an idiot is winning an argument with an idiot. It just isn't worth the effort with these people.

PatDunne wrote:

Just to clarify, I find a suicide bomber rather more offensive than for example a person drawing a cartoon of a monkey.

Could I possibly infer from that statement that you might just be white?

Obviously nobody would prefer to be blown up, but I have a feeling you wouldn't be so blithe about people being racist towards you, or calling you a monkey if you were actually a black person who has suffered that racist trope and been persecuted by it throughout history.

To clarify, I'm not saying that it is worse than being murdered but I just don't think it should be taken so lightly either.

Hitch wrote:

pepsipete wrote:

Think some people are confusing race with religion.  For instance you do not have to be a Jew to be Israili.

Just a few ignorant idiots Pete who are incapable of reading a cogent argument against organised religion before leaping on the racist bandwagon in a pathetic attempt to stifle truth and reason. So weak, so ignorant, so stupid, so village, so sinister, so dangerous but somehow so predictable.

The only thing that anybody can succeed at when debating an idiot is winning an argument with an idiot. It just isn't worth the effort with these people.

Religion. Fundamentally dull subject matter and an utterly pointless debate because depending on who you've spoken to, what you've read, heard or seen, or whose influence you've taken, this will ultimately determine which side of the line your definition of 'right' will fall.

It's almost as boring as politics, albeit probably a tad less corrupt.

In other news, at least this cnut should be getting a good seeing to behind bars pretty soon...

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Ah the old R word. Nowadays such a powerful word, used so effectively by the Left to kill any relevant debate stone dead. Indeed so powerful a word that fear of it amongst the police, social workers & council officials has allowed 1400 young white girls, abducted, raped & sexually assaulted repeatedly in Rotherham to be sacrificed on the alter of political correctness.

Evidently this is just the tip of the iceberg & the same horrific crimes are being carried out with  impunity in many towns & city around the UK. Pakistani Muslim paedophile rings have also been exposed in Rochdale, Bristol, Bradford, Halifax, Newcastle, Oxford, Keighley, Blackpool, Oldham, Preston, Derby, Telford, Ipswich, Birmingham, Barking & Peterborough in the past few years.

I'd be interested to hear how those shouting racist in the posts above explain this one away or doesn't racism work the other way around ?