Darren Purse

Purse was really good on this programme Britain's Gay Footballers last night, as was Joey Barton.

Usual BBC3 fare, with slightly too much padding, but John Fashanu's daughter did a great job of digging into why no professional players have come out since her uncle Julian, including confronting her father for apparently disowning his own brother. Well worth a look.

I watched part of it. I did laugh at the Brighton v Leeds match (as I've heard some of those chants at HP)- Matt Lucas seemed to think the chants were funny- are they homophobic or banter (a question that was asked on the programme with a 50:50 split)?

Yes, saw the programme Peggy. It was Uncle Justin actually. I find the almost total reluctance by footballers to comment on the issue somewhat surprising in this day and age. If there are 10% gay men in the UK as intimated I would guess it would be much lower within the football fraternity as there are plenty of other professions where the percentage would be much higher. However, I think the numbers would at least be in their tens in the professional game.

Joey Barton was very good. Darren Purse was at least prepared to go in front of the camera which seemingly no other club would sanction for their players (although the slightly childish giggling of other younger? players when asked about it showed how much work has to be done)

John McGovern on it made me cringe. Seemed unable to fathom that there was any kind of problem.

In my capacity of twitter stalker I did see that Chris Webb tweeted that his Union had tried an initiative to get football clubs to sign up to some kind of anti homophobic agenda with only one club Barnsley or Bradford doing so.

Chemical Ali wrote:

I watched part of it. I did laugh at the Brighton v Leeds match (as I've heard some of those chants at HP)- Matt Lucas seemed to think the chants were funny- are they homophobic or banter (a question that was asked on the programme with a 50:50 split)?

Dunno. Some of the chants are quite witty - 'we can see you holding hands', which the Brighton fans answer with 'you're too ugly to be gay'

What I think they do illustrate, though, is that being gay (or being thought to be gay) is still viewed in many quarters as relevant grounds for the kind of banter which too easily becomes abuse. In the way that, for instance, being black isn't.

End of the day, it's clear there's a lot of people out there who feel they have to live a lie. And that, if they worked in a different profession, they'd be able to be open. That's really sad.

Dougie - spot on about John McGovern: I'd forgotten him, but he was truly terrible.

And Swampy - I knew it was Justin even as I was typing Julian

And Swampy - I knew it was Justin even as I was typing Julian [/quote]

I know you did Patsy, no worries. McGovern was really poor. Miss fashanu was quite good but I never got the impression she was trying very hard to dig deep.

Peggy wrote:

Chemical Ali wrote:

I watched part of it. I did laugh at the Brighton v Leeds match (as I've heard some of those chants at HP)- Matt Lucas seemed to think the chants were funny- are they homophobic or banter (a question that was asked on the programme with a 50:50 split)?

Dunno. Some of the chants are quite witty - 'we can see you holding hands', which the Brighton fans answer with 'you're too ugly to be gay'

What I think they do illustrate, though, is that being gay (or being thought to be gay) is still viewed in many quarters as relevant grounds for the kind of banter which too easily becomes abuse. In the way that, for instance, being black isn't.

End of the day, it's clear there's a lot of people out there who feel they have to live a lie. And that, if they worked in a different profession, they'd be able to be open. That's really sad.

Dougie - spot on about John McGovern: I'd forgotten him, but he was truly terrible.

And Swampy - I knew it was Justin even as I was typing Julian

I'm not sure these attitudes are just confined to football though. I have a family member who came out about two years ago at the age of 42. His father practically had a nervous breakdown and was going to sell his house and move abroad. What was amusing was that he immediately looked to me for support as a typical big burly "proper bloke" which were his words, he assumed I would be homophobic.

No, Iggy, they're not confined to football, which is tragic. But wide swathes of society have changed massively since Justin Fashanu killed himself, while football - even if only judged by the programme last night - has hardly moved an inch.

Dougie wrote:

Joey Barton was very good. Darren Purse was at least prepared to go in front of the camera which seemingly no other club would sanction for their players (although the slightly childish giggling of other younger? players when asked about it showed how much work has to be done)

John McGovern on it made me cringe. Seemed unable to fathom that there was any kind of problem.

In my capacity of twitter stalker I did see that Chris Webb tweeted that his Union had tried an initiative to get football clubs to sign up to some kind of anti homophobic agenda with only one club Barnsley or Bradford doing so.

I am not one of these TWATS or TWITS or whatever they are called but that has to be applauded. Well done Beany!

Dougie wrote:

Joey Barton was very good. Darren Purse was at least prepared to go in front of the camera which seemingly no other club would sanction for their players (although the slightly childish giggling of other younger? players when asked about it showed how much work has to be done)

John McGovern on it made me cringe. Seemed unable to fathom that there was any kind of problem.

In my capacity of twitter stalker I did see that Chris Webb tweeted that his Union had tried an initiative to get football clubs to sign up to some kind of anti homophobic agenda with only one club Barnsley or Bradford doing so.

I am not one of these TWATS or TWITS or whatever they are called but that has to be applauded. Well done Beany!

Peggy wrote:

No, Iggy, they're not confined to football, which is tragic. But wide swathes of society have changed massively since Justin Fashanu killed himself, while football - even if only judged by the programme last night - has hardly moved an inch.

I have to agree, football is a huge dinosaur that badly needs to evolve, too much money at the top for people to risk rocking the boat though.