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Hugh Watt



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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 12:20 pm

I see they've scrapped 3 electrification schemes

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I don't believe what is now being peddled that the bi-mode trains will run just as well off diesel otherwise they wouldn't have bothered with the wires in the first place. More likely the cost has spiraled hopelessly out of control and they have no wriggle space.

I'm more inclined to agree with the Lords assertion that they won't be as fast on diesel as the HST and will struggle round the bends, it just sounds so inefficient.
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Lord Melbury

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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:12 pm

Be interesting to see how the new trains cope with a high tide at Dawlish in a bit of an Easterly gale Hugh.

Cross Country Voyagers often get suspended at Exeter but the forty year old HSTs just plough on through it.
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tigertony

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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:28 pm

Whats the so called time gain going to some DNB place? 25 minutes? Absolute waste of money. Use the cash to introduce in-flight (on-track) movies, trolley dollies and massage services!
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PatDunne



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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:49 pm

tigertony wrote:
Whats the so called time gain going to some DNB place? 25 minutes? Absolute waste of money. Use the cash to introduce in-flight (on-track) movies, trolley dollies and massage services!


I could guess at what you mean by DNB and again it makes you a complete unfunny twat... why do you do it?
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Graiser

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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 4:53 pm

Hugh Watt wrote:
I see they've scrapped 3 electrification schemes

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I don't believe what is now being peddled that the bi-mode trains will run just as well off diesel otherwise they wouldn't have bothered with the wires in the first place. More likely the cost has spiraled hopelessly out of control and they have no wriggle space.

I'm more inclined to agree with the Lords assertion that they won't be as fast on diesel as the HST and will struggle round the bends, it just sounds so inefficient.

These trains are faster than HST's, they're required to enable constant running off our area and then under the wires running into Paddington and on similar routes.

The curves will not be an issue, up to when I retired in April all clearance issues in regards to curvature, platforms and Signal clearances had been corrected as far as Plymouth, which was proved recently with a trial run into Plymouth on the 17th of this month.

As to the seating comfort on the train compared to HST's I've no idea on that.
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Graiser

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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 5:01 pm

Lord Melbury wrote:
Be interesting to see how the new trains cope with a high tide at Dawlish in a bit of an Easterly gale Hugh.

Cross Country Voyagers often get suspended at Exeter but the forty year old HSTs just plough on through it.  

Apparently we were told the design of these trains would enable them to traverse Dawlish during adverse weather, so I assume that means the electrics are not on top of the loco as the Voyagers have, no doubt we'll see about that during future testing!
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Graiser

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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 5:08 pm

PatDunne wrote:
tigertony wrote:
Whats the so called time gain going to some DNB place? 25 minutes? Absolute waste of money. Use the cash to introduce in-flight (on-track) movies, trolley dollies and massage services!


I could guess at what you mean by DNB and again it makes you a complete unfunny twat... why do you do it?

I shouldn't comment really but I can't help but notice your constant trolling and abusive comments towards TT on any comment he seems to make, not sure if there's any requirement for that or has he upset you in a previous life ?
I'm no apologist for TT and I've got my tin hat on for my turn but I was just a bit curious

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tigertony

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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 6:01 pm

PatDunne wrote:
tigertony wrote:
Whats the so called time gain going to some DNB place? 25 minutes? Absolute waste of money. Use the cash to introduce in-flight (on-track) movies, trolley dollies and massage services!


I could guess at what you mean by DNB and again it makes you a complete unfunny twat... why do you do it?
It wasn't me. My 4 year old grand-daughter got on the keyboard while I was fetching her Farley's rusk. I blame the schools.
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PatDunne



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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 6:23 pm

Graiser wrote:
PatDunne wrote:
tigertony wrote:
Whats the so called time gain going to some DNB place? 25 minutes? Absolute waste of money. Use the cash to introduce in-flight (on-track) movies, trolley dollies and massage services!


I could guess at what you mean by DNB and again it makes you a complete unfunny twat... why do you do it?

I shouldn't comment really but I can't help but notice your constant trolling and abusive comments towards TT on any comment he seems to make, not sure if there's any requirement for that or has he upset you in a previous life ?
I'm no apologist for TT and I've got my tin hat on for my turn but I was just a bit curious


However you are an apologist for someone who thinks the term 'Dirty Northern Bastards' is acceptable..........
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Graiser

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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 6:43 pm

PatDunne wrote:
Graiser wrote:
PatDunne wrote:
tigertony wrote:
Whats the so called time gain going to some DNB place? 25 minutes? Absolute waste of money. Use the cash to introduce in-flight (on-track) movies, trolley dollies and massage services!


I could guess at what you mean by DNB and again it makes you a complete unfunny twat... why do you do it?

I shouldn't comment really but I can't help but notice your constant trolling and abusive comments towards TT on any comment he seems to make, not sure if there's any requirement for that or has he upset you in a previous life ?
I'm no apologist for TT and I've got my tin hat on for my turn but I was just a bit curious


However you are an apologist for someone who thinks the term 'Dirty Northern Bastards' is acceptable..........

I don't think that term is acceptable at all, in fact until you enlightened me I didn't have a clue what DNB stood for, but thanks
for the clarity.
However still not sure what your reasoning for the other occasions are but c'est la
vie i suppose, anyway won't waste anymore time on this. I'm watching HP fill up and waiting for kick off, you have a nice night .
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Hugh Watt



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Location : Over there....

PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 8:10 pm

Graiser wrote:
Hugh Watt wrote:
I see they've scrapped 3 electrification schemes

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I don't believe what is now being peddled that the bi-mode trains will run just as well off diesel otherwise they wouldn't have bothered with the wires in the first place. More likely the cost has spiraled hopelessly out of control and they have no wriggle space.

I'm more inclined to agree with the Lords assertion that they won't be as fast on diesel as the HST and will struggle round the bends, it just sounds so inefficient.

These trains are faster than HST's, they're required to enable constant running off our area and then under the wires running into Paddington and on similar routes.

The curves will not be an issue, up to when I retired in April all clearance issues in regards to curvature, platforms and Signal clearances had been corrected as far as Plymouth, which was proved recently with a trial run into Plymouth on the 17th of this month.

As to the seating comfort on the train compared to HST's I've no idea on that.

What about beyond Plymouth and specifically the curve into Saltash?

A quick google suggests GWR leases 8 of the pacers operating out of Exeter i.e. Between barnstaple and exmouth and you are correct in saying they will phased out by 2020 as they don't meet DDA laws that are due to come in.
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Graiser

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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:37 pm

Hugh Watt wrote:
Graiser wrote:
Hugh Watt wrote:
I see they've scrapped 3 electrification schemes

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I don't believe what is now being peddled that the bi-mode trains will run just as well off diesel otherwise they wouldn't have bothered with the wires in the first place. More likely the cost has spiraled hopelessly out of control and they have no wriggle space.

I'm more inclined to agree with the Lords assertion that they won't be as fast on diesel as the HST and will struggle round the bends, it just sounds so inefficient.

These trains are faster than HST's, they're required to enable constant running off our area and then under the wires running into Paddington and on similar routes.

The curves will not be an issue, up to when I retired in April all clearance issues in regards to curvature, platforms and Signal clearances had been corrected as far as Plymouth, which was proved recently with a trial run into Plymouth on the 17th of this month.

As to the seating comfort on the train compared to HST's I've no idea on that.

What about beyond Plymouth and specifically the curve into Saltash?

A quick google suggests GWR leases 8 of the pacers operating out of Exeter i.e. Between barnstaple and exmouth and you are correct in saying they will phased out by 2020 as they don't meet DDA laws that are due to come in.

I had a list of all the clearance issues from Taunton to Penzance but I cannot recall a specific clearance problem for this train at Saltash, I'm not saying there isn't one as it's well known that the platforms at Saltash are too low but I just cannot remember any clearance issue on the list, when we carried a recent relay of the points at Saltash we had a significant problem with the geometry from the bridge running into the platform, but I will find out.
From memory the clearance issues requiring significant works were in the Lostwithiel area and ground position lights at St Erth
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tigertony

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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Fri Jul 21, 2017 11:05 pm

PatDunne wrote:
Graiser wrote:
PatDunne wrote:
tigertony wrote:
Whats the so called time gain going to some DNB place? 25 minutes? Absolute waste of money. Use the cash to introduce in-flight (on-track) movies, trolley dollies and massage services!


I could guess at what you mean by DNB and again it makes you a complete unfunny twat... why do you do it?

I shouldn't comment really but I can't help but notice your constant trolling and abusive comments towards TT on any comment he seems to make, not sure if there's any requirement for that or has he upset you in a previous life ?
I'm no apologist for TT and I've got my tin hat on for my turn but I was just a bit curious


However you are an apologist for someone who thinks the term 'Dirty Northern Bastards' is acceptable..........
I do look forward to your insults Uncle Pat. What I find amusing, almost ''wetting myself'' amusing, is that you jump on a phrase that is used tongue-in-cheek by 100s of fans when chanting and telling other fans about their heritage and yet you frequently use a phrase that is considered rather rude and uneducated. Onwards we go - by a fast train soon.
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Graiser

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Location : Plymouth

PostSubject: Re: HS2   Mon Jul 24, 2017 2:58 pm

Graiser wrote:
Hugh Watt wrote:
Graiser wrote:
Hugh Watt wrote:
I see they've scrapped 3 electrification schemes

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I don't believe what is now being peddled that the bi-mode trains will run just as well off diesel otherwise they wouldn't have bothered with the wires in the first place. More likely the cost has spiraled hopelessly out of control and they have no wriggle space.

I'm more inclined to agree with the Lords assertion that they won't be as fast on diesel as the HST and will struggle round the bends, it just sounds so inefficient.

These trains are faster than HST's, they're required to enable constant running off our area and then under the wires running into Paddington and on similar routes.

The curves will not be an issue, up to when I retired in April all clearance issues in regards to curvature, platforms and Signal clearances had been corrected as far as Plymouth, which was proved recently with a trial run into Plymouth on the 17th of this month.

As to the seating comfort on the train compared to HST's I've no idea on that.

What about beyond Plymouth and specifically the curve into Saltash?

A quick google suggests GWR leases 8 of the pacers operating out of Exeter i.e. Between barnstaple and exmouth and you are correct in saying they will phased out by 2020 as they don't meet DDA laws that are due to come in.

I had a list of all the clearance issues from Taunton to Penzance but I cannot recall a specific clearance problem for this train at Saltash, I'm not saying there isn't one as it's well known that the platforms at Saltash are too low but I just cannot remember any clearance issue on the list, when we carried a recent relay of the points at Saltash we had a significant problem with the geometry from the bridge running into the platform, but I will find out.
From memory the clearance issues requiring significant works were in the Lostwithiel area and ground position lights at St Erth

Hugh just to confirm it's as I thought, there are no platform clearance issues at Saltash.

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Hugh Watt



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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:31 pm

I see TransPennine wires are now in doubt. Yet the Government are throwing their weight behind Crossrail 2. So much for rebalancing the economy and the northern powerhouse

I think these bi-mode trains will be a disaster. Electrical traction equipment will be installed meaning additional mass will be carried for no reason on non-electrified track or diesel will be sloshing about needlessly under the wires. The whole thing should have been accurately costed before throwing themselves into all these projects.

I'm missing something but I do not get the business case for crossrail at all
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Graiser

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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:37 pm

Hugh Watt wrote:
I see TransPennine wires are now in doubt. Yet the Government are throwing their weight behind Crossrail 2. So much for rebalancing the economy and the northern powerhouse

I think these bi-mode trains will be a disaster. Electrical traction equipment will be installed meaning additional mass will be carried for no reason on non-electrified track or diesel will be sloshing about needlessly under the wires. The whole thing should have been accurately costed before throwing themselves into all these projects.

I'm missing something but I do not get the business case for crossrail at all

Ah that's  because we live in the back of beyond !
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PatDunne



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PostSubject: Re: HS2   Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:24 pm

If Plymouth had 5 million population I'm pretty sure there would be motorway{s) international airport, another train line, trams? John Lewis, Ikea, but cost/benefit says what? for 260.000 of us.
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